If they wanted Armenian majority regions as the part of Armenia they should have given Azerbaijani majority regions like East Sevan or Kapan, Amasya to Azerbaijan. You cannot just take a part of a country without giving something back
The minority rights topic of Armenians in NK was something else and definetly there were ethnic tensions, sad things happened to Azerbaijani Armenians. However, the invasion of Azerbaijan wasnt the answer to this lol
Worth-Pay-691 on
They won’t take care of it. But the funny thing is that, they recognize Karabakh as a part of Azerbaijan
Inevitable_4791 on
When Turkey and Armenia are fighting over history, what are they fighting over? They are fighting over definitions, not events. We are not even fighting over definitions, not even events, over nothing at all actually. This is a simple zero-sum game. Armenia is not just an enemy, is the the enemy. Not because of Russians, not because of Russian colonization, not because of Russian geopolitical games.
To understand why Armenians are the way they are today, you need to look at what happened pre Sovietization.
Modern day Armenia went trough a homogenization program before Sovietization. Here, our ancestors who spoke Armenian, married with Armenians got massacred and expulsed in the hundreds of thousands. It is important to note that cruel actions were being undertaken in Nakhchivan against our ancestors too, and it is important to not forget that the plan was to genocide Karabakh of our ancestors too. Later, they allied with Bolsheviks and started massacring us all the way to Baku. After this, retaliatory massacres happened, even in this instance, i am not deranged enough like Armenia to say that this was self defense, however the blame for these solely lie on Armenia with their zero-sum game. It was either them, or us.
These events are at best scrubbed from Armenian history, and at worst celebrated by their people.
Now we have to understand why Armenians are the way they are today. It is because their culture, while they will say they are anti-ARF, it is a continuation of ARF culture and its zero-sum game.
That is why they genuinly think that Azeris are always out to eradicate them, because they have simply been completely brainwaished. Again, we are not even discussing events, they literally believe in mythological course of history. If they would actually open a book, the whole system would fall down.
That is how it is hilarious to read online discourse. These folks put up wikipedia links with Shusha and September days, but magically no mention of the March days and Ozanians genocide ever gets mentioned. These people are at best brainwashed and ignorant, and at worst sinister and just want to keep the brainwashing going as they are part of the death cult.
That is why genuinly, no course of reconciliation will ever happen. You need to understand that when you are conversing with Armenia, events are mythologized, and that is why they celebrate these events. That is how it is possible to cleanse 7 regions and kill 16 thousand civilians in “self defense”.
That is how it is possible, like in Melkonians book, where they kidnap an activist, chain him to a barn for a month, take a dull knife and cut his throat over graves while baptizing a kid when the poor kid is moaning in the background. Or that one Armenian general that kept POWs as personal slaves. They would go and have briefings and in the corner of the room chained up POWs would be there. Like in the book, you are a two footed bipedal for them, not a human.
I have visited Iran, i have visited Georgia, i spoke with Armenians there. My grandparents talked about Armenians in Baku. They were all great, normal people. What you notice with them is basically, if ARF ideology gets inserted, its over, its done. Its either you, or them. The goal for both Georgia and Iran is to make sure absolutely no Armenian influence ever gets introduced there as it can bring catastrophic results. The Armenians there that are not brainwashed by this ideology understand this well.
When you correctly teach and understand history, you will understand its either us, or them. And it is best to just contain them. The natural and logical consequense of this death cult is that they will eventually eat each other up and chain each other to the walls as slaves.
5lumlordmillionaire on
Allying with Turkey, the country that refuses to recognize ita genocide of Armenians, and systematically destroying millenia-old Armenian cultural sites don’t help the Azeri victim narrative.
JabroniCalzogni on
What Armenians did in Nagorno-Karabakh is the same as Southern Azerbaijan national awakening movement and the Azerbaijan national resistance organization except Armenians have always been in Nagorno-Karabakh since the dawn of time even before both Nakhichevan and NK was a part of the the 1st Republic of Armenia until recently in 2023.
ProfessionalGolf9613 on
To be honest you should do one of those with Eastern Turkey … 1.5 million dead Armenians.
Or do one with occupied northern Cyprus.
possibly mention the 400,000 Armenians deported from Azerbaijan in the last 30 years.
Pure propaganda.
Perhaps you should consider unchecked Turkic expansionism
lmsoa941 on
Armenians are not indigenous to those regions 🤦.
Nor did we have thousands of years of continuous significant history.
Nor were we oppressed in those regions…
Holy shit
Shamakhii on
It was a bad comparison btw. Maximum Mexico annexing the lands would be more interesting example.
kawhileopard on
What are we looking at when we question whether Armenia is the victim?
Are we looking the most recent war? Because there was an agreed upon truce and relative peace for decades before that.
Are we looking at the war that took place in the late 80s and early 90s? That started before either county had independence?
Are we going back further?
If you want to have an honest discussion, I think you should define clearer terms.
To be clear I am neither Armenian nor Azerbaijani.
chrissie_brown on
This happened in real. My ancestors are from Sudetenland. Now it’s clean of all Germans by the Czechs.
RhombusJ on
Artsakh residents fighting for their independence:
Azerbaijanis: MONSTERS!! LET’S ETHNIC CLEANSE THEM!!
KermitIsDissapointed on
Comparing the ethics of Armenian-Azerbaijani conflicts is about as productive as doing it with the Yugoslav Wars.
Brief-Shirt15 on
Çox gülməli müqayisədi. Ermənilər müasir Azərbaycanda aborigen xalq idi, ABŞ-da elə deyildi.
15 Comments
They won’t listen. They don’t care
I’d be ok with it.
If they wanted Armenian majority regions as the part of Armenia they should have given Azerbaijani majority regions like East Sevan or Kapan, Amasya to Azerbaijan. You cannot just take a part of a country without giving something back
The minority rights topic of Armenians in NK was something else and definetly there were ethnic tensions, sad things happened to Azerbaijani Armenians. However, the invasion of Azerbaijan wasnt the answer to this lol
They won’t take care of it. But the funny thing is that, they recognize Karabakh as a part of Azerbaijan
When Turkey and Armenia are fighting over history, what are they fighting over? They are fighting over definitions, not events. We are not even fighting over definitions, not even events, over nothing at all actually. This is a simple zero-sum game. Armenia is not just an enemy, is the the enemy. Not because of Russians, not because of Russian colonization, not because of Russian geopolitical games.
To understand why Armenians are the way they are today, you need to look at what happened pre Sovietization.
Modern day Armenia went trough a homogenization program before Sovietization. Here, our ancestors who spoke Armenian, married with Armenians got massacred and expulsed in the hundreds of thousands. It is important to note that cruel actions were being undertaken in Nakhchivan against our ancestors too, and it is important to not forget that the plan was to genocide Karabakh of our ancestors too. Later, they allied with Bolsheviks and started massacring us all the way to Baku. After this, retaliatory massacres happened, even in this instance, i am not deranged enough like Armenia to say that this was self defense, however the blame for these solely lie on Armenia with their zero-sum game. It was either them, or us.
These events are at best scrubbed from Armenian history, and at worst celebrated by their people.
Now we have to understand why Armenians are the way they are today. It is because their culture, while they will say they are anti-ARF, it is a continuation of ARF culture and its zero-sum game.
That is why they genuinly think that Azeris are always out to eradicate them, because they have simply been completely brainwaished. Again, we are not even discussing events, they literally believe in mythological course of history. If they would actually open a book, the whole system would fall down.
That is how it is hilarious to read online discourse. These folks put up wikipedia links with Shusha and September days, but magically no mention of the March days and Ozanians genocide ever gets mentioned. These people are at best brainwashed and ignorant, and at worst sinister and just want to keep the brainwashing going as they are part of the death cult.
That is why genuinly, no course of reconciliation will ever happen. You need to understand that when you are conversing with Armenia, events are mythologized, and that is why they celebrate these events. That is how it is possible to cleanse 7 regions and kill 16 thousand civilians in “self defense”.
That is how it is possible, like in Melkonians book, where they kidnap an activist, chain him to a barn for a month, take a dull knife and cut his throat over graves while baptizing a kid when the poor kid is moaning in the background. Or that one Armenian general that kept POWs as personal slaves. They would go and have briefings and in the corner of the room chained up POWs would be there. Like in the book, you are a two footed bipedal for them, not a human.
I have visited Iran, i have visited Georgia, i spoke with Armenians there. My grandparents talked about Armenians in Baku. They were all great, normal people. What you notice with them is basically, if ARF ideology gets inserted, its over, its done. Its either you, or them. The goal for both Georgia and Iran is to make sure absolutely no Armenian influence ever gets introduced there as it can bring catastrophic results. The Armenians there that are not brainwashed by this ideology understand this well.
When you correctly teach and understand history, you will understand its either us, or them. And it is best to just contain them. The natural and logical consequense of this death cult is that they will eventually eat each other up and chain each other to the walls as slaves.
Allying with Turkey, the country that refuses to recognize ita genocide of Armenians, and systematically destroying millenia-old Armenian cultural sites don’t help the Azeri victim narrative.
What Armenians did in Nagorno-Karabakh is the same as Southern Azerbaijan national awakening movement and the Azerbaijan national resistance organization except Armenians have always been in Nagorno-Karabakh since the dawn of time even before both Nakhichevan and NK was a part of the the 1st Republic of Armenia until recently in 2023.
To be honest you should do one of those with Eastern Turkey … 1.5 million dead Armenians.
Or do one with occupied northern Cyprus.
possibly mention the 400,000 Armenians deported from Azerbaijan in the last 30 years.
Pure propaganda.
Perhaps you should consider unchecked Turkic expansionism
Armenians are not indigenous to those regions 🤦.
Nor did we have thousands of years of continuous significant history.
Nor were we oppressed in those regions…
Holy shit
It was a bad comparison btw. Maximum Mexico annexing the lands would be more interesting example.
What are we looking at when we question whether Armenia is the victim?
Are we looking the most recent war? Because there was an agreed upon truce and relative peace for decades before that.
Are we looking at the war that took place in the late 80s and early 90s? That started before either county had independence?
Are we going back further?
If you want to have an honest discussion, I think you should define clearer terms.
To be clear I am neither Armenian nor Azerbaijani.
This happened in real. My ancestors are from Sudetenland. Now it’s clean of all Germans by the Czechs.
Artsakh residents fighting for their independence:
Azerbaijanis: MONSTERS!! LET’S ETHNIC CLEANSE THEM!!
Comparing the ethics of Armenian-Azerbaijani conflicts is about as productive as doing it with the Yugoslav Wars.
Çox gülməli müqayisədi. Ermənilər müasir Azərbaycanda aborigen xalq idi, ABŞ-da elə deyildi.
P.S. Demirəm keçmiş DQMV ərazisinə müstəqillik verilməlidir, sadəcə müqayisə yanlış və gülnəlidir.